Fundamentally, clans and traditional RPG classes do the same thing. They represent how a player wants to play the game. When you choose a clan, you’re telling your Storyteller, “I want to do the sorts of stuff my clan is known for.” You can mess with that a bit, but for the most part, a clan is what it is.
Before clans, most depictions of vampires recalled the classic, Lugosi-style revenant aristocrat.Further than that, though, the clans do something that classes don’t. They construct a social presence. They’re something to which a character belongs, and they’re a concept around which players can build a social solidarity for their characters. When combined with an illustrated, explanatory two-page spread, they enable a player to say, “My character is like that… and there are others like him, who may well have his back.”
In theory, this is little more than faction. It’s an organization and a player belongs to it. It’s not that different from pledging fealty to the duke or enlisting in the space marines. In practice, though, it’s a much more momentous thing. It’s an automatic point of commonality with other vampires, Kindred who are not alike only in their suggested function or occupation (like a class), but who share a lineage, a supernatural proclivity, and probably even an outlook.
It’s a social network, that is. A clan fills a game role by giving a character a function, like a class, but also a sense of belonging. It tells players, “There are others like you. Find them and do your clan shit. That strength in numbers will help you against your common enemies.” Oh, and you certainly have some common enemies. Right there in that two-page spread it told you what your clan’s prevailing attitude was toward other clans, and you can bet it isn’t, “Yeah, those guys are pretty cool. You can trust them.”
So there: All in one elegant, fun declaration of self you have:
- Function
- Image
- Attitude
- Allies (ostensibly, as this is Vampire, after all…)
- Validation
- Direction
- Plot hooks
As an added bonus, clans give you the opportunity to play against type, effectively doubling that buffet of options up there. You may want to be the rebellious Ventrue, the Gangrel in repose, the humanistic Nosferatu. All of that positive stuff, well, it’s still content if it’s a negative you want to oppose or a social more you want to flout. It’s still grist for the roleplaying mill.
TIm Bradstreet’s timeless, iconic modern vampire, which still strikes an emotional chord twenty years after its first appearance. A fine piece of work, despite being done by a Steelers fan.I remarked at a GenCon panel this year that the two-page spreads were magic, and I stand by that statement. Early drafts of Vampire didn’t have the clans. A vampire was a vampire was a vampire, and that’s all fine and good, but aside from needing to drink blood, and the assumed competition among each other for this finite (and taboo) resource, where was the conflict? With eternal life and no other inherent motivations, what did vampires do? The clans took shape in that vacuum.
Introducing clans was Chris McDonough’s idea, and it came comparatively late to the development of the game. I have to think that it was the masterstroke of the game, that one magic moment when a mostly good game suddenly had its chrysalis and became a great game. Everything else worked and then, when clans became a part of it all, they tied everything together and even provided a bit of extra dimension that grew into a part of the Vampire milieu that ultimately became inextricable from it — perhaps even its focus. What better way to illustrate the religious motif pervading Vampire than with a literal transference of the sins of the sire to the childe? This concept naturally made the transition from Masquerade to Requiem. Those other, post-Vampire elements of pop culture that borrowed from Vampire, whether the houses in the Wesley Snipes Blade movie to the different factions of Underworld to the familial groups of MySpace sparkletards in Twilight and the Camarilla-redolent societies in True Blood all bear the mark and capitalize on the gravity of Vampire‘s clan concept.
The clans all have distinct personalities and characters, whether from Masquerade or Requiem, and always have.The clans were bigger than any signature character, and that’s all to the good. In fact, they might be so sovereign as to eclipse the single most recognizable “character” in the World of Darkness: the world itself.
Let’s get personal. I remember being introduced to the World of Darkness through Vampire. Although Mage was my first real love among the White Wolf games, I came back to Vampire in short order, entirely because I loved the clans, their feel, and what they represented. I knew that at one-on-one tabletop games or fifty-person live-action games, I’d have a contingent of clanmates who might well be allies or antagonists, but who would represent a specific take on the vampire myth. They were people first and foremost, but I could at the very least understand them as vampires and take it from there.
Imagine: What would Vampire be without clans? It would certainly be personal, because the individual’s motivation would take prominence. But for those players who want a little extra guidance, some examples to follow, and some culture to be a part of… what in the game could take their place? What could accomplish what clans do as elegantly, as characteristically, and as indelibly as the clans? Without clans, Vampire certainly wouldn’t be the same game, and it’s likely that you and I wouldn’t be talking about it now.
My experience with the clans has always been a little contradictory. I love how they’re written, and how they crystallize the thematics into handy little packets. Unfortunately, down here in the trenches of play, they can be a hassle. One person will say “Oh, I like the Ventrue, I think I get them,” and then another person goes “YOU DON’T GET MY BELOVED VENTRUE AT ALL, DEPART!” and little schisms will form around who “gets” it and who doesn’t. I’ve seen a dozen groups end this way, nearly identically each time. It then compounds the second White Wolf writes some supplement that further details the clans… those schisms then schism further, and eventually you get a bunch of players who are obsessed with the material but all universally loathe each other for not “getting” it. Part of me suspects that if you just called them “Lords” and “Succubi” and left off the high-falutin’ names from them, it might solve this problem, but then, knowing Vampire fans, you’d get beheaded chickens on your front porch.
See, that’s actually the kind of thing I really enjoy. It shows that the concept has taken on a life larger than what the writers impart to it, and it’s a firsthand demonstration of people’s passion. I imagine the vampires themselves probably bitch about what it really means to be a Ventrue, and about how Joe Ventrue isn’t a real Ventrue like Tom Ventrue and his subsect.Here’s a great example. Check out these guys productively and reasonably (aw, heck) discussing the lacunae and weirdnesses of world lore.
…. actually – referring to your summary:So there: All in one elegant, fun declaration of self you have: ….You include ‘Allies’ but not ‘Enemies’… I’d say enemies provide a “fun” element as well =) hehe/Allan
I do not remember adhering to the generic concept of a clan, but to the themes and background of specific clans, all with their distinct flavor. Perhaps the success of the clans does also result from the choices that were made with the implementation of the concept? They often look like identity statements designed by a marketing department. :)You did not mention what is, for me, one of the most (if not the most) important aspect of clans. They are families first and foremost, with parents and children and grandchildren, united against the outside world and divided by conflicts born of their condition. Families + immortality = all manners of entertainment. Think Zeus, think Amber, think Philip José Farmer’s Thoans.I would love to see a system which would ground Internet vampires in undead families, up to including the possibility to Embrace into the game the characters of other players, with mechanical consequences (diminution of a characteristic) mitigated by the fruits of cooperation. The resultant history could be walked away from, but not ignored.
Factions? Classes?I suppose oblique references and having to read between the lines is better than nothing, can’t wait for when you unviel how classes work and which ones are not being included…….and the screams of anguish from xxxx clan player that their beloved clan make the entire game work….
… actually Cyril – now that you mentioned the embrace. I’m wondering if Justin and co. are thinking about that design perspective as well for the game. The embrace… and how that supposedly could work – if it even will become implemented.What I mean is – I would love for the game to involve a mechanism that in some way can help balance the amount of vampires, as well as werewolves actually.So people automatically started out as humans, and had to solve a puzzle/quest or the like, to be accepted and ‘embraced’.That could for example be different quests/puzzles for each clan, and then _IF_ a player wanted to be accepted there, they’d either have to be bitten by a player that already is a vampire of that clan and has the permission from the sherif or the like, to embrace others / bite them.When I propose and mention this is not because I want it to be an elitist society (even though it sort of is), but I also mention it to have some sort of game mechanism to preverse some level of continuity, so we won’t eventually end up having a LOAD of newbie vampires running around, completely destroying the atmopshere more than they have to.Comments anyone?/Allan
The worst thing they could do with this game is allow people to start off as supernaturals from the getgo. Vampires, werewolves, mages… Those guys should be rather uncommon. It’d kill me as a roleplayer to hop into the server, only to see a million vampires hanging out. Keep the embrace, the first change could be randomized, the awakening as well. Don’t let this become yet another supernatural fantasy game. Keep the personal horror! Keep us looking over our shoulders.
Either that, or let us have permadeath with inheritability. There needs to be some way to cull overpopulation. :/
Justin, what’s the balance between “I’m a member of Clan Elfpants, enjoyably differentiated from other clans” vs. “You’re still a freaking vampire!”? I remember that in your time as developer of Masquerade, you were keen to break up the clans as fraternities idea. I agree with all about everything you’ve said up there, and if nothing else, the idea that you can somehow trust one of your own clan is a thing of beauty for a good Storyteller to betray mercilessly. But how do you get the balance right as a developer? How do you keep the uniqueness while still maintaining the wider theme of universal damnation; how do you keep the social goodness and tension while maintaining the paranoia that says you can only trust yourself?
RE: Clans Transcending ClassesI suppose I understand the point your trying to make here, I’m just not sure that I agree with it. Classes almost always come equipped with implied social networks. The fantasy big four – Fighters, Rogues, Wizards, and Clerics – immediately bring to mind knightly orders, mercenary companies, guilds, churches, schools of magic, and masters and apprentices. Hell, level even suggests ranks within these implied organizations, and earlier versions of dnd ignored implication and actually assigned you a title based on your level.Thats not to say that I don’t think clans are awesome – I’m just not sure they represent a design technology that is significantly “evolved” from class.Additionally, while I’m not personally a oWoD grognard, I also think that Requiem Clans are more like DND classes then in Masquerade. In VtM, clans are basically the preeminent social structure, and are much more specialized in role and natural aptitude, with a long role of sordid occult histories, diabolical plots, and infamous luminaries that really went a long way in helping a player understand the various gradients possible in any particular shade of vampire. In contrast, Requiem spends a lot of time moving away from Clans as the most iconic step of character creation in favor of Covenants, with clans becoming more like icing then the cake itself.RE: Sire Questing in the MMOIn contrast to the opinions on this topic in the posts above, I personally think that mandatory “Supernatural template questing” is an absolutely terrible idea. The Super Sekret Quest to become what the majority of prospective players really want to be would seem to me to be a great way for the game to become the Star Wars Galaxies of Modern Horror MMOs. I don’t think anyone wants that.
Personally though, I think that becoming a mage should be as simple as witnessing a random number of supernatural acts (1 to 10, 20, 30, 40 or so, easier with the Unseen Sense merit. more obviously supernatural things would cause more “occurrences” to be tracked by points counting down to awakening), Being embraced should be done by a player or a “staff member”, First Changes at random requiring the Wolf-Blooded merit, and so on. I also think that things like werewolf tribe, Mage Path, and so on should be based on what your character’s stats are best suited for/ best fitting character or world wise.Same with starting Giest keys, changeling kith, and so on. Mind you any of these would have to be included for this implimentation to be taken with them.The idea is that the player has initially no control over when he becomes a supernatural, and the character would have to know that they are witnessing something weird to awaken as a mage, random circumstanceswould have to happen for them to experience the first change if they were wolf-blooded, and the embrace would be done only if they impressed somebody that was already a vampire. Say an abyssal manifestation happens- based on how severe it is and what the person has done or witnessed before, they may awaken right then.
To me, The idea of clans in VTM screams PvP (Player versus Player) since it puts a conflict between the Characters and their Factions, not always a violent conflict but coupled with the other mechanics like Diablery and Viniculum the conflict has more potential for growth Covenants in VTR cushion this effect by saparating Clans from Factions which leaves Clans as something of an old fashioned bias and its less taken for granted that Clans have organizations since Covenants now hold that role. Of course this preception is subjective and the importance of Clans in VTR really depends who you ask but I think most who play VTR can agree that Clan is secondary to Covenant if it has any serious consequence at all.Both systems accomplish the same thing, engage the players in a conflict that they can respond to in more than one way as an added value on top of whatever the core storyline is, so by being a baseline for interaction it can keep things interesting in a Sandboxed enviroment even in cases where the Storyteller is not doing such a great job..
Classes were what draw me to MMOs. And vampire clans were what draw me to WoD. They are just the most amazing classes I know.I think one of the biggest qualities of WoD is the complexity of its social groups. Vampire for example: Coterie; Clan; Covenant; City; Bloodline.The player should be able to choose the way he will prioritize them.Maybe for someone the clan is one top then he worries about his covenant obligations, for other the clan have to wait because he have to care about his beloved covenant. Giving the players more options is ways the best choice.[offpost]And since we are talking about player choices, selling a game which the main attractive is to play a supernatural and tell that they can’t do that is a great way to build a fail. But I have no concerns, CCP/WW wouldn’t do that.To control supernatural per human population “just” make a huge world (like EvE’s universe) populated with lots of semi-random created human NPCs with a good AI.[/offpost]
is always the best choice*=)
Honestly, I’ve always thought that WoD was about personal horror. Supernaturals, while a major part of that terror, are secondary to that terror. I see the appeal though, people always want to play something inherently impossible to experience in reality, thus the reason these things are made. :X
As for AIs… I just can’t see a group of AI humans replacing the potential of a PC human community, with sporadic human NPCs littered throughout. Even the most advanced AIs pale in comparison to human capability.
Aj, I agree that humans should be playable. They seen to me as a perfect fit to the casual “carebear” player.I also think that making them playable would take little development cost. And a simple mechanical advantage as a smoother death penalty would make them balanced.[/offpost
Alan I think that when you say Supernatural in relation to the WoD alot of it is a curse mixed along with the blessing which doesn’t tend to sit well with people who were expecting to play a Dark Superhero.And since WoD is written in a Sci-fi sort of way (most of its ideas of world building seem to be speculative based on a theortical situation) if you take away or ignore the fatal flaws of most of these supernaturals, especially vampires, you end up with a very different social structure and a different world.For example I’m pretty sure the Invictus and most of the other Covenants would look very different if they exsist at all in a world where Vampires are not afraid of daylight or the mortals who can expose them to it.Same goes for Blood Drinking, Viniculum, Embrace and Diabelrie , all of these are tied together and the Clans and Covenants are built around them and from them. And that goes double for VTM where the Sabbat and Camarilla are based entirely around these flaws.Also another thing that occurs to me is that I think players would play a good game regardless of if they can play a supernatural or not, As long as there is equal opportunity/potential for everyone I don’t think people would complain, I know I wont.
Oh no Radical, again with that. Before I start let me say that: I’m in favor of all weaknesses. I love them, and I think that these weaknesses give the setting meaning.With that said let me elaborate on what I was trying to say before.If a theoretical on-line game about supernaturals has a harsh death penalty (compared to traditional EQ-clones but normal compared to EvE) together with all weaknesses of the supernatural race and the madness that is supernatural conflicts (internals or externals), maybe that game wouldn’t attract everyone, more specifically the carebear crowd.Carebears are the players that prefer PvE instead of PvP, don’t like to die and if they die they don’t like to lose all their stuff because of it. In my opinion humans are the perfect fit for these players. They would be able to experience the PvE side of the game like housing or owning a business without having to care that much about supernatural conflicts.The problem is that they would be an easy target for grieving as they always are in free for all PvP mmos. That’s why I mentioned a smother death penalty for them (with some limitation to prevent suicidal attacks).I think this mechanics would also make Hunters possible and balanced for PvP.So basically these players would represent the small fraction of humans that know about the existence of supernaturals.
I think griefplay wont happen as often in WoD if all the rules and mechanics are at play. mortals can get back at vampires during daylight and they have the advantage of numbers and they can play at a Vampire’s other vlunrabitilites which would make playing a vampire harder and running around randomly ‘pwning noobs’ would probably earn any vampire a final death(within the parmaters of whatever death penalty in place). So what I meant is that Vampires may be stronger and faster but are they better? not always. I know some PvPers would probably prefer to play Hunters who are weaker but do not have any supernatural vlunrabilities and are more versatile. There are very few good open PvP MMORPGs out there currently(if any at all) and I think regardless of what class you get to play , many gamers would savor the opportunity to play a well balanced PvP MMORPG. Back on topic: I think the Clans and Covenants are also good because they engage the player in a totally different game than the other supernaturals and mortals despite the fact that they are all still on the same playfield. I also like the possibilty to author new clans and covenants since they challange the player to adopt the writing approach of the core clans/covenants and try to come up with something that encompass their philosophy and character traits.